Hello and welcome to a special episode of In Conversation with Nathalie Nahai – the podcast that explores our relationship with one another, with technology and with the animate world.

On this rare occasion, I have the pleasure of interviewing two friends of the podcast – Manda Scott and Rupert Read – about their powerful, compelling and practical new book, Transformative Adaptation.

A selection of essays by leading practitioners and pioneers this book lays out approaches for adaptation that work with, not against nature, and it is a theory and a practice, a community and an attitude, designed to support us in imagining and creating a flourishing future even in the jaws of adversity.

Rupert Read is an eco-philosopher, academic, author, campaigner, UK Green politician, and environmental activist. Having been a key spokesperson for the Extinction Rebellion movement, Rupert now dedicates his time to the Climate Majority Project as its Co-Director.

Manda Scott is a Thrutopian novelist, podcaster and smallholder. Formerly a veterinary surgeon, Manda’s novels have been shortlisted for the Orange Prize, the Edgar and the Saltire Award, and she has won the McIlvanney Prize. She is host of the popular Accidental Gods podcast, which showcases individuals and organisations at the emerging edge of our world, to set the foundation for a future we’d be proud to leave to the generations that come after us.

SUMMARY

In this conversation, Nathalie Nahai, Manda Scott, and Rupert Read explore the themes of collective awakening to climate risks, the importance of imagination in envisioning a flourishing future, and the vital role of art and creativity in shaping narratives. They discuss the necessity of community action for transformative adaptation and the significance of acknowledging despair as a pathway to empowerment. The conversation emphasises learning from the Global South's experiences and the evolving consciousness among politicians regarding climate realities. Ultimately, they call for individuals to recognise their power to influence change and to build a shared narrative of possibility for a sustainable future.

BOOK

• US edition of TrAd: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/801723/transformative-adaptation-by-edited-by-rupert-read-and-morgan-phillips-with-manda-scott/
• UK edition of TrAd: https://www.permanentpublications.co.uk/port/transformative-adaptation/

WEBSITES

• Edge Cities: https://www.edgecity.live/
• Edge City in California: https://www.edgeesmeralda.com/
• Our House (creating civil charters by Peoples’ Assemblies): https://ourhouseuk.org/
• OPUS in Sheffield: https://www.weareopus.org/

Rupert Read

• https://rupertread.net/
• https://climatemajorityproject.com/

Manda Scott

For the final episode of the season, I have the distinct pleasure of being in conversation with the renowned author, activist and friend of the podcast, Rob Hopkins.

Having interviewed him about his powerful book, From What Is to What If: Unleashing The Power Of Imagination To Create The Future We Want in episode 87, I had to invite him to return to the show to dive into his new, eagerly awaited sequel: How to Fall in Love with the Future: A Time Traveller’s Guide To Changing The World.

To give you a bit of background, Rob is the co-founder of Transition Town Totnes and the Transition Network, he has authored several titles including The Transition Handbook, The Transition Companion, The Power of Just Doing Stuff, and 21 Stories of Transition , and he presents the podcast series From What If to What Next.

In 2012, he was voted one of the Independent’s top 100 environmentalists and was on Nesta and the Observer’s list of Britain’s 50 New Radicals. Rob has also appeared on BBC Radio 4’s “Four Thought” and “A Good Read”, in the French film phenomenon Demain and its sequel Après Demain, and has spoken at TEDGlobal and three TEDx events.

An Ashoka Fellow, Rob also holds a doctorate degree from the University of Plymouth and has received two honorary doctorates from the University of the West of England and the University of Namur. In November 2022 he was made an Honorary Citizen of Liège in Belgium by the Mayor of the city. Rob runs ‘Imagination Catalyst’ trainings for organisations as diverse as Balenciaga, London Marathon Group, local councils and Museum Booster, he’s collaborated with musician Mr Kit on a project called Field Recordings from the Future, due out in 2025, and he is a keen gardener and a director of Totnes Community Development Society, the group behind Atmos Totnes, an ambitious, community-led development project.

Now, this season has been focusing heavily on AI – its impact in the world, how we develop it, how we approach it, discerning fact from fiction, uncovering some of the more existential questions, and figuring out how to chart a path forward that gives us back our sense of agency, creativity, imagination, and collective power. And so for me it felt really fitting to land this series speaking to Rob about his extraordinary ways in which we can really breathe ourselves into a future that is flourishing, beautiful and just. And to take that as a starting place, the fertile ground, from which to anchor any imagination around what technology and other aspects of life, could bring.

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A brief note: When we recorded this episode, there were road-works being carried out in the street outside - and while we’ve done our best to reduce the noise, I’m including a note here to flag that the audio drop outs in my voice are not due to Caro C’s work, but are the result of pre-editing carried out by someone else. I hope you’ll enjoy the episode nonetheless!

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SUMMARY

In this conversation, Rob Hopkins and Nathalie Nahai explore the importance of imagination and longing in activism. They discuss the need for community, the skepticism towards AI, and the power of collective action in creating a flourishing future. Rob shares insights from his book, 'How to Fall in Love with the Future,' emphasizing the significance of storytelling and social technologies in shaping a better world. The dialogue highlights the necessity of nurturing imagination and the potential for human beings to enact extraordinary change.

WEBSITES

Today I have the pleasure of speaking with a dear friend and one of the most extraordinary Realist Painters of our generation, Carl de Jager.

Born and raised in South Africa, Carl is a fine artist and co-founder of The Realist Painter, a project that delivers painting and drawing workshops across multiple European locations including Greece, Spain, Cyprus, and Austria, distilling years of classical training into highly focused learning experiences.

Having originally obtained a Bachelor of Arts with a major in Art History, Carl went on to have a successful career as a software engineer in Melbourne, and he later pivoted to pursue classical drawing and painting at the prestigious Barcelona Academy of Art.

A well loved and respected teacher and program coordinator, delivering instruction from fundamental drawing techniques to advanced painting methods, Carl also oversees specialised courses including Light and Form and Portrait programs.

I actually had the pleasure of being taught by Carl in person while studying at BAA, an experience which (as some of you may know), fundamentally changed the course of my life – prompting a change in country, an expanding of community, and a shifting of priorities that gave rise not only to this podcast and the Salons, but to my painting and music-making that are now at the heart of my daily life.

I’ve been wanting to bring Carl onto the show for a long while, especially since he brings such a unique, multifaceted approach to creativity, art and AI. It’s not often one gets the opportunity to speak to someone with such deep expertise in both art and technology, which is why this conversation was such a gift.

And another gift – if you’ve ever felt a call to paint or draw, The Realist Painter are hosting a really exciting collaborative workshop this September with one of the most celebrated painters of the contemporary art world, Scott Waddell, formerly from the Grand Central Academy in New York. This rare workshop will focus on the great 19th century master , Bouguereau, and it’s selling out fast – so if you’ve been holding back on your creative impulse and you want to experience the best teaching the art world has to offer, from some of the most sought-after artists, this is for you. I’ll put the links in the shownotes, or you can visit The Realist Painter.com.

SUMMARY

In this conversation, Carl and Nathalie explore the intersection of creativity and AI, discussing the nature and process of creativity and the implications of AI on artistic expression. They discuss the complexities of cultural gatekeeping, the future of art in an AI-driven world, and the challenges surrounding intellectual property. The dialogue highlights the importance of personal experience in creativity and the evolving role of technology in artistic practices.

LINKS

https://www.instagram.com/carldejager.art/

https://www.carldejager.com/

https://www.therealistpainter.com/

https://www.instagram.com/therealistpainter/

CHAPTERS

02:58 The Essence of Creativity

05:59 AI's Role in Artistic Expression

08:55 The Intersection of Human and AI Creativity

12:03 The Complexity of Artistic Creation

15:11 Cultural Gatekeeping in Art

17:52 The Future of Art and AI

21:06 Responsibility and Understanding AI's Impact

34:22 The Trust Crisis in Governance

36:18 Reconsidering Copyright and Intellectual Property

42:49 The Evolution of AI...