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Today’s Episode:

Late last week, the Israeli security cabinet approved a proposal by Prime Minister Netanyahu to conquer Gaza City, where roughly half the Gazan population resides, and which has been largely untouched by the IDF thus far.

This decision has prompted widespread international backlash, which was already mounting from concerns over a possible food crisis in Gaza. It also comes as more countries move to recognize a Palestinian state, forcing us to grapple with the high price Israel is paying on the global stage for the ongoing Gaza war.

With this in mind, on today’s episode, Dan speaks with Dr. Micah Goodman about whether there’s a difference between winning the war in Gaza and winning the wider, regional war. Is it possible that Israel will need to modify its definition of victory in Gaza in order to emerge victorious in the larger re-shaping of the geopolitics of the Middle East?

Micah Goodman is a research fellow at the Shalom Hartman Institute and co-host of the popular Israeli podcast Mifleget Hamachshavot produced by Beit Avi Chai.

00:00 Introduction

05:17 The outcome of war with Iran

08:46 Public opinion on Iran war

13:22 Saudi normalization will split the Israeli right

18:02 The price of normalization

23:10 Who can lead normalization?

24:50 The next Israeli elections

26:53 How does Israel end the war in Gaza?

30:20 Losing the battle to win the war

31:34 Returning the hostages

32:25 Victory in the future versus victory now

34:52 Hamas anticipating Israel’s strategy

CREDITS:

ILAN BENATAR - Producer & Editor

ADAAM JAMES LEVIN-AREDDY - Executive Producer

MARTIN HUERGO - Sound Editor

MARIANGELES BURGOS - Additional Editing

MAYA RACKOFF - Operations Director

GABE SILVERSTEIN - Research

YUVAL SEMO - Music Composer

If you’re already subscribed to INSIDE Call me Back, listen to the extended version of this episode – on the INSIDE Call me Back feed.

To subscribe to Inside Call me Back please go to: inside.arkmedia.org

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Gift a subscription of Inside Call me Back: inside.arkmedia.org/gifts

Watch Call me Back on YouTube: youtube.com/@CallMeBackPodcast

Check out Ark Media’s other podcasts:

• For Heaven's Sake: lnk.to/rfGlrA
• ‘What’s Your Number?’: lnk.to/rbGlvM

For sponsorship inquiries, please contact: callmeback@arkmedia.org

To contact us, sign up for updates, and access transcripts, visit: arkmedia.org/

Ark Media on Instagram: instagram.com/arkmediaorg

Dan on X: x.com/dansenor

Dan on Instagram: instagram.com/dansenor

To order Dan Senor & Saul Singer’s book, The Genius of Israel: tinyurl.com/bdeyjsdn

Today’s Episode:

Prime Minister Netanyahu is expected to present the cabinet with a plan for the full military occupation of Gaza today. According to reports, the plan’s first phase entails the evacuation of Gaza City and an expansion of humanitarian aid, in coordination with the United States. The second phase would see an IDF takeover of Gaza City with an even bigger expansion of aid, backed by $1 billion from the U.S. and other countries.

This comes despite pushback from IDF Chief of Staff Eyal Zamir and other security officials, who — according to reports — have serious concerns about the risks of this military expansion.

To discuss this breaking news, Dan is joined by Ark Media contributors Amit Segal and Nadav Eyal. You can hear more of Dan’s thoughts on the subject at the beginning of today’s INSIDE Call me Back episode.

00:00 Introduction

03:20 The plan to occupy Gaza

05:15 The significance of Gaza City

06:57 Concerns about the plan

12:02 Where does Hamas lie?

17:47 Israeli public opinion on the plan

CREDITS:

ILAN BENATAR - Producer & Editor

ADAAM JAMES LEVIN-AREDDY - Executive Producer

MARTIN HUERGO - Sound Editor

MARIANGELES BURGOS - Additional Editing

MAYA RACKOFF - Operations Director

GABE SILVERSTEIN - Research

YUVAL SEMO - Music Composer

You can subscribe to Inside Call me Back at inside.arkmedia.org

If you have a friend or family member who you think would enjoy being a subscriber, we have gifting options available here: inside.arkmedia.org/gifts

Watch Call me Back on YouTube: youtube.com/@CallMeBackPodcast

Check out Ark Media’s other podcasts:

• For Heaven's Sake: lnk.to/rfGlrA
• ‘What’s Your Number?’: lnk.to/rbGlvM

For sponsorship inquiries, please contact: callmeback@arkmedia.org

To contact us, sign up for updates, and access transcripts, visit: arkmedia.org/

Ark Media on Instagram: instagram.com/arkmediaorg

Dan on X: x.com/dansenor

Dan on Instagram: instagram.com/dansenor

To order Dan Senor & Saul Singer’s book, The Genius of Israel: tinyurl.com/bdeyjsdn